Social Media Alters Thought, Demands Authentic Self-Definition - Episode Hero Image

Social Media Alters Thought, Demands Authentic Self-Definition

The Ezra Klein Show · · Listen to Original Episode →
Original Title:

TL;DR

  • Social media platforms, designed as behavior modification systems, fundamentally alter users' thinking by dictating daily topics and debate structures, leading to significant, often unrecognized, modifications of individual consciousness.
  • The "facts don't care about your feelings" mentality is a fascistic denial of human nature, as emotion is a crucial, albeit not sole, indicator of truth and a vital component of human experience and decision-making.
  • The Tichborne case illustrates how populism can arise when established institutions fail to provide justice, allowing a claimant's narrative to gain traction through emotional resonance rather than factual accuracy.
  • The digital age's emphasis on constant self-definition and curated online personas erodes the "private person" and the value of mystery, leading to a superficial understanding of others and oneself.
  • While identity groups are necessary for civil rights, existential reliance on them leads to a revolt against the self, as true human freedom lies in embracing an amorphous, uncontainable self.
  • The perceived "linguistic turn" in activism, while inefficient, is a natural response to a lack of material power, where language becomes the only accessible battleground for expressing grievances.
  • Aging can lead to profound loneliness, particularly for men lacking robust social networks, highlighting the societal neglect of this experience and the value of cultivated, intimate relationships.

Deep Dive

Zadie Smith argues that profound political and technological shifts compel individuals to solidify their identities, often at the expense of nuanced, "amorphous" selves, but that this enforced solidity is ultimately a form of oppression that humans naturally revolt against. This dynamic, explored through the lens of 19th-century populism and the pervasive influence of smartphones, highlights a fundamental tension between the need for collective action and the human desire for individual complexity, suggesting that true freedom lies in resisting such rigid categorization.

Smith's historical novel, "The Fraud," uses the Tichborne claimant trial to illustrate how populism can arise when established institutions fail to provide genuine justice, allowing for a symbolic victory for the disenfranchised even if material gains are absent. This mirrors contemporary political movements where a shared sense of grievance and a desire to challenge elite institutions can unite disparate groups, regardless of the practical benefits offered. The novel also examines the varying forms of intelligence and lived experience, positing that intellectualism, as often defined by dominant social classes, is only one mode of understanding, and that practical wisdom and emotional insight are equally vital. This challenges the notion of a singular, meritocratic intelligence, suggesting that diverse ways of knowing are essential for a complete understanding of the world.

The pervasive influence of smartphones and social media is presented not merely as a new medium, but as a sophisticated system of behavioral modification, designed to shape thought and direct attention. This constant, totalizing "capture" fundamentally alters individuals' capacity for sustained attention and self-definition, creating a fragmented self that is constantly performing for an audience. Smith contrasts this with a dream of a peer-to-peer internet that fosters genuine connection and mystery, a space where individuals are not defined by algorithms or forced into performative identities. This echoes her broader argument that while identity groups are necessary for civil rights, they become oppressive when they serve as the sole existential definition of a person, leading to a revolt against such imposed limitations. The podcast also touches on the generational divides amplified by this digital context, noting how each generation seeks its own space and identity, a process that can become fraught with conflict when mediated by online discourse, ultimately underscoring the profound human need for an uncontainable self.

The conversation concludes by exploring the profound impact of aging and the potential for loneliness, particularly for men, while also highlighting the value of deep, intimate relationships. Smith suggests that true freedom lies not just in unrestrained choice, but in the privacy and authenticity found in genuine connection, a space where one can be fully oneself without performance. She posits that while technology may offer new ways to connect, it can also lead to a superficial understanding of others, obscuring the complexity and depth of individual experience. This underscores the enduring human challenge of truly knowing another person, a pursuit that requires active listening and a willingness to embrace the mystery of the self, both in intimate relationships and on a societal scale.

Action Items

  • Audit digital communication: Analyze 3-5 platforms for behavior modification patterns (ref: Neil Postman's "Amusing Ourselves to Death").
  • Create personal "amorphous self" framework: Define 3-5 core values that transcend rigid identity groups for daily reflection.
  • Measure impact of digital interaction: Track personal attention span and emotional regulation over 2-week periods, comparing pre- and post-digital detox.
  • Draft "mystery" cultivation plan: Identify 3-5 activities that foster privacy and reduce self-performance for personal well-being.
  • Evaluate communication channels: Compare effectiveness of peer-to-peer vs. algorithm-driven content for personal intellectual growth over 1 month.

Related Episodes

Key Quotes

"We absolutely need to gather in our identity groups sometimes for our freedoms, for our civil rights. There’s absolutely no doubt about that. But for that role to be the thing that is you existentially all the way down -- that is something that I personally believe all human beings revolt from at some level."

Zadie Smith argues that while identity groups are crucial for civil rights and freedoms, they should not define an individual's entire existence. She believes that humans inherently resist being solely defined by such group affiliations, suggesting a natural inclination towards a more complex and individual sense of self.

"millions of more or less amorphous selves will now necessarily find themselves solidifying into protesters activists marchers voters firebrands impeachers lobbyists soldiers champions defenders historians experts critics you can't fight fire with air but equally you can't fight for freedom you've forgotten how to identify what Smith is describing there felt so familiar to me I see it so often in myself in people around me and I rarely actually hear it talked about that that moment when politics seems to demand or world events seem to demand that we put aside our internal conflicts our uncertainty our many selves and solidify into what the cause or the moment needs us to be as if curiosity were a luxury a decadence suited only to peacetime"

This quote from Zadie Smith highlights the pressure individuals feel to adopt rigid public personas in response to political and social events. The author observes that this solidification of self, often at the expense of internal complexity and curiosity, is a common experience that is rarely openly discussed.

"I am so aware without trying to sound falsely humble or that I am a complete idiot about so many things and yet I have this particular intelligence in in a very extremely narrow area which has allowed me to make the life I've made but if you ask me the most basic facts of the universe or even the relationship between the sun and the moon basic math geography i mean there are just acres of ignorance in my life no matter practical knowledge to do things with your hands to make things or even how to run a group how to speak to people how to relate to others it's endless the things that I'm not good at there are many many contexts in the world that I can go into and be a true fool truly lost and that's important to know when you move through the world that this thing you call intellect this thing that you value this thing which may even be the basis of your kind of meritocratic existence has limited use and that there are many many ways to be intelligent in this world"

Zadie Smith reflects on the limitations of her own intellect, acknowledging vast areas of ignorance despite her specialized intelligence. She emphasizes that what society defines as "intellect" is often narrow and that true intelligence manifests in many diverse forms, a crucial realization for navigating the world.

"The facts don't care

Resources

External Resources

Books

  • "White Teeth" by Zadie Smith - Mentioned as a novel by the author.
  • "On Beauty" by Zadie Smith - Mentioned as a novel by the author.
  • "NW" by Zadie Smith - Mentioned as a novel by the author.
  • "The Fraud" by Zadie Smith - Mentioned as the author's novel, which was written with Trump and populism in mind.
  • "Feel Free" by Zadie Smith - Mentioned as a book of essays by the author, containing a point about amorphous identities solidifying under political pressure.
  • "Fascinated to Presume: In Defense of Fiction" by Zadie Smith - Mentioned as an essay by the author from the collection "Feel Free."
  • "Amusing Ourselves to Death" by Neil Postman - Mentioned as a book that argues television makes politics entertaining and dominated by entertainers.
  • "The Director" by Daniel Kehlmann - Recommended as a book about filmmaker W.G. Sebald and complicity, particularly in the Holocaust.
  • "The Rebel's Clinic" by Adam Shatz - Recommended as a book about Frantz Fanon, rescuing his legacy and presenting him as a hero and human being.
  • "The Diaries of Virginia Woolf" - Recommended as a source of pleasure and insight into Woolf's mind.

Articles & Papers

  • "Generation Why?" by Zadie Smith - Mentioned as an essay by the author.

People

  • Zadie Smith - Author of novels and essays, guest on the podcast.
  • Neil Postman - Media theorist whose book "Amusing Ourselves to Death" is discussed.
  • Daniel Kehlmann - Author of "The Director," recommended by Zadie Smith.
  • Adam Shatz - Author of "The Rebel's Clinic," recommended by Zadie Smith.
  • Virginia Woolf - Author whose diaries are recommended.
  • Annie Galvin - Producer of "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Michelle Harris - Fact-checker for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Kate Sinclair - Fact-checker for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Jeff Geld - Senior engineer for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Aman Sahota - Additional mixing engineer for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Efim Shapiro - Additional mixing engineer for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Claire Gordon - Senior editor for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Rollin Hu - Production team member for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Elias Isquith - Production team member for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Kristin Lin - Production team member for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Isaac Jones - Original music composer for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Kristina Samulewski - Audience strategy for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Shannon Busta - Audience strategy for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Annie-Rose Strasser - Executive producer of New York Times Opinion Audio.
  • Ross Sorkin - Founder of Dealbook, who interviews influential leaders.
  • Gavin Newsom - Mentioned as someone interviewed by Ross Sorkin.
  • CEO of Palantir - Mentioned as someone interviewed by Ross Sorkin.
  • Ericka Kirk - Widow of Charlie Kirk, mentioned as someone interviewed by Ross Sorkin.
  • Charlie Kirk - Mentioned as someone interviewed by Ross Sorkin.
  • Jane Austen - Author whose novels are discussed in relation to teaching literature.
  • Barack Obama - Former president, mentioned in relation to political polarization and identity.
  • Steve Jobs - Mentioned in relation to the design and sale of the iPhone.
  • Marshall McLuhan - Media theorist from the television age.
  • Elizabeth Strout - Author whose work is referenced in relation to knowing people deeply.
  • Nick - Zadie Smith's husband, mentioned in relation to privacy.

Organizations & Institutions

  • The Ezra Klein Show - Podcast where the conversation takes place.
  • New York Times Opinion Audio - Production entity for "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • Dealbook Summit - Live event where Ross Sorkin interviews leaders.
  • Palantir - Company whose CEO was interviewed by Ross Sorkin.
  • Anthropic - Company whose CEO was interviewed by Ross Sorkin.
  • New York Times - Publisher of "The Ezra Klein Show" and Wirecutter.
  • Wirecutter - Product recommendation service from the New York Times.

Websites & Online Resources

  • nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast - Website for "The Ezra Klein Show" episodes and transcripts.
  • https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs - Website listing book recommendations from guests of "The Ezra Klein Show."
  • nytimes.com/holidayguide - Website for Wirecutter's gift recommendations.

Other Resources

  • Populism - Discussed in relation to Zadie Smith's novel "The Fraud" and political movements.
  • Smartphones - Discussed as behavior modification systems that alter thinking and attention.
  • Social Media - Discussed as platforms that modify behavior and influence self-definition.
  • Wokeness - Term discussed by Zadie Smith, who refuses the "bait" of it.
  • Radical Humanism - A philosophy Zadie Smith identifies with, emphasizing the infinite potential of individuals.
  • Existentialism - A philosophy Zadie Smith identifies with, emphasizing that people are thrown into life and circumstances are significant.
  • Identity Groups - Mentioned as necessary for freedoms and civil rights, but not for existential identity.
  • Identity Politics - Discussed in relation to the visibility of identity and hierarchical reversal.
  • Behavior Modification System - How smartphones and social media are described.
  • Linguistic Turn - Discussed in relation to young people fighting in the realm of language due to lack of material freedoms.
  • Free Speech - Term used in backlash against the linguistic turn.
  • Late Capitalism - Mentioned as a force that can trap individuals.
  • Jewish Identity - Discussed in relation to personal conflict and the term Zionism.
  • Zionism - Term discussed in relation to Jewish identity and political conflict.
  • BAME - A term for Black, Asian, and Minority Ethnic people, discussed in relation to new language for identity.
  • The Change - A term for a feminine form of delusion associated with aging women.
  • Gen Z - A younger generation whose online discourse and emoji use is contrasted with millennials.
  • Millennials - A generation discussed in relation to their online discourse and desire for acceptance from younger generations.
  • Gen X - A generation mentioned in the context of believing they had solved youth.
  • The 60s - Mentioned in relation to peace and love, contrasted with later generations' beliefs.
  • Complicity - A theme in "The Director" and related to slavery and the Holocaust.
  • Hierarchical Reversal - A concept Zadie Smith dreamt of, where those at the center of history are made to look at the world differently.
  • African Diasporic Thought - Mentioned as a flowering of thought essential for Zadie Smith's writing.
  • Peer-to-peer internet - A desired model for the internet, contrasting with current algorithmic structures.
  • Algorithms - Discussed as a philosophy and ideology that classifies everything, impacting art forms differently.
  • Containment - How stable notions of identity can create boundaries around people.
  • Mystery - An idea that technologies do not cater to, contrasting with the desire for classification.
  • Aspiration Devices - How social media platforms are described as telling users what to value.
  • Loneliness - Discussed in relation to aging, particularly for men, and the lack of social networks.
  • Privacy - Described as a form of freedom where one is not on stage and can simply be.
  • Marriage - Mentioned as a potential source of intimacy and privacy.
  • The Tichborne Case - A 19th-century trial central to Zadie Smith's novel "The Fraud."
  • The OJ Trial - Mentioned as a parallel to the Tichborne case, expressing generalized feelings about justice.
  • Class - Discussed as a significant factor in intelligence and life experience.
  • Gender - Discussed as a constraint on women's lives in the 19th century.
  • Slavery - Mentioned as the absolute nadir of no movement, freedom, or choice.
  • Exclusion - A theme in "The Fraud," particularly related to aging.
  • Aging - Discussed in relation to loneliness, loss of beauty, and changing physical capacity.
  • Mirrors - Described as operating on a time delay for women, reflecting past beauty.
  • Social Networks - Discussed in relation to men's and women's experiences with aging.
  • Performance - How life and even friendships can sometimes feel performative.
  • Listening - Described as a difficult but essential aspect of truly knowing people.
  • Definition - The lack of definition or role in the world as a source of exclusion for aging women.
  • The Other - The experience of being the "other" in a social context, as described by white people in non-Western settings.
  • Political Dialectic - Discussed in relation to black and white identities, and the absurdity of age-based discourse.
  • Youth - Described as a premium in mediated society, with each generation believing they have solved it.
  • Comprehension of Chronological History - Necessary for some art forms like writing, but not for music.
  • Behavioral Modification Devices - How smartphones and social media are characterized.
  • Aspirational Devices - How social media platforms suggest values.

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